This still enrages me....and I was thinking of the CO cakemaker when I made this thread btw.

Heres a tad bit of irony for ya concerning this thread subject. And whats with all the CO cake bakers being all involved in controversy? lol


"" DENVER — A dispute over a cake in Colorado
raises a new question about gay rights and
religious freedom: If bakers can be fined for
refusing to serve married gay couples, can
they also be punished for declining to make a
cake with anti-gay statements?
A baker in suburban Denver who refused to
make a cake for a same-sex wedding is
fighting a legal order requiring him to serve
gay couples even though he argued that
would violate his religious beliefs.
But now a separate case puts a twist in the
debate over discrimination in public
businesses, and it underscores the tensions
that can arise when religious freedom
intersects with a growing acceptance of gay
couples.
Marjorie Silva, owner of Denver’s Azucar
Bakery, is facing a complaint from a customer
alleging she discriminated against his
religious beliefs.
According to Silva, the man who visited last
year wanted a Bible-shaped cake, which she
agreed to make. Just as they were getting
ready to complete the order, Silva said the
man showed her a piece of paper with hateful
words about gays that he wanted written on
the cake. He also wanted the cake to have
two men holding hands and an X on top of
them, Silva said.
She said she would make the cake, but
declined to write his suggested messages on
the cake, telling him she would give him icing
and a pastry bag so he could write the words
himself. Silva said the customer didn’t want
that.
“It’s just horrible. It doesn’t matter if, you
know, if you’re Catholic, or Jewish, or
Christian, if I’m gay or not gay or whatever,”
said Silva, 40, adding that she has made
cakes regularly for all religious occasions.
“We should all be loving each other. I mean
there’s no reason to discriminate.”
Discrimination complaints to Colorado’s Civil
Rights Division, which is reviewing the matter,
are confidential. Silva said she would honour
the division’s policy and would not share the
correspondence she has received from state
officials on the case. KUSA-TV reported the
complainant is Bill Jack of Castle Rock, a
bedroom community south of Denver.
In a statement to the television station, Jack
said he believes he “was discriminated
against by the bakery based on my creed.”
“As a result, I filed a complaint with the
Colorado Civil Rights Division. Out of respect
for the process, I will wait for the director to
release his findings before making further
comments.”
Jack did not respond to emails from The
Associated Press seeking comment. No one
answered the door at the address listed for
Jack in Castle Rock.
The case comes as Republicans in Colorado’s
Legislature talk about changing the state law
requiring that businesses serve gays in the
wake of a series of incidents where religious
business owners rejected orders to celebrate
gay weddings. Republican Sen. Kevin
Lundberg said the new case shows a “clash of
values” and argued Colorado’s public
accommodation law is not working.
“The state shouldn’t come in and say to the
individual businessman, ’You must violate
your religious — and I’ll say religious-slash-
moral convictions. This baker (Silva), thought
that was a violation of their moral
convictions. The other baker, which we all
know very well because of all the stories,
clearly that was a violation of their religious
convictions,” Lundberg said.
But gay rights advocates say there is a
significant difference in the cases. Silva
refused to put specific words on a cake while
Jack Phillips, the baker who turned away the
gay couple, refused to make any wedding cake
for them in principle.
“There’s no law that says that a cake-maker
has to write obscenities in the cake just
because the customer wants it,” said Mark
Silverstein, legal director of the American Civil
Liberties Union in Colorado.
Phillips’ attorneys had argued in court that
requiring him to prepare a gay marriage cake
would be akin to forcing a black baker to
prepare a cake with a white supremacist
message. But administrative law judge Robert
N. Spencer disagreed, writing that business
owners can refuse a specific message, but not
service.
“In both cases, it is the explicit, unmistakable,
offensive message that the bakers are asked
to put on the cake that gives rise to the
bakers’ free speech right to refuse,”
administrative law judge Robert N. Spencer
said.
Phillips’ attorney, Nicolle Martin, said she has
sympathy for Silva, arguing she is in the same
category as her client. “I absolutely support
her right to decline,” Martin said. “I support
her right as an American to pick and choose
the messages she will express.”
Silva said she remains shaken up by the
incident. “I really think I should be the one
putting the complaint against him, because
he has a very discriminating message,” she
said.""
Link.

@WalkSoftly: I really think that article is bias & miss leading..
"Celebrating gay marriage"... no.. They are bakers, they bake, they are not celebrating ANYONES marriage.
And neither of the bakers " refuse to serve gays/ homosexuals"... They refused to make a wedding cake. They offered FREE cakes to those customers. And one baker ever REFERED them to another baker that would make a wedding cake.

So when are these trouble makers who target " white Christian bakers"... Going to Muslim bakers? Or Kosher bakers? Geez, what kind of requests for those guys? A ham flavored cake w/ men kissing on top w/ a rainbow on the side? ...

Let them try that.. I can't wait.
Tbh, I'm sick of the Anti Christian PC crap. All major religions (all 4 or 5) of them are against homosexuality. Guess which one has the death penalty for it? It is not the Christian faith.

@Zilya777: so far as I know, only the Abrahamic religions are anti-homosexual. I can't think of another one off hand that is...

Ladawn sent me this article today....some get the gist of the problem...and they happen to be gay.

"" By Valerie Richardson - The Washington
Times - Thursday, January 23, 2014
Alan Sears doesn’t know what it’s like to be
refused service for being gay, but he does
know what it’s like to be refused service for
being a conservative.
Six months ago, a Southern California
photographer turned him down flat when he
asked her to take a Christmas card photo of
his family, explaining in an email, “I oppose
the goals and objectives of your organization
and have no interest in working on its behalf.”
That was fine with Mr. Sears, CEO and general
counsel of the conservative Alliance Defending
Freedom, who is leading the legal battle on
behalf of photographers, florists, cake
decorators and others sued for refusing to
create products for same-sex weddings.
What applies to wedding cake designers asked
to violate their core beliefs, Mr. Sears argues,
applies equally to liberals who decline to fill
certain orders to conservatives customers.
“We’re talking about human dignity. It violates
someone’s dignity to require them to create
images that violate their core beliefs,” Mr.
Sears said. “I think I’m a pretty nice guy, and
my family are kind folks, but to require this
woman to portray me in a loving, family-
centered way that is contrary to her views and
her conscience, I think it would be an act of
violence against her dignity.”
Not long ago, his argument was widely
dismissed by civil rights advocates as the
isolated view of a subset of far-right
Christians, but that is changing. A growing
number of libertarians, supporters of same-sex
marriage and even gays themselves are lining
up with the Arizona-based legal defense group
as the issue moves toward the Supreme Court.
The ADF has asked the high court to review a
decision against Elane Photography, whose
owner Elaine Huguenin refused to take photos
at a same-sex wedding. The New Mexico
Supreme Court ruled in August against the
photographer, saying she had violated the
state’s nondiscrimination clause by agreeing
to shoot wedding photos for opposite-sex
couples but not gay couples.
Those filing friend-of-the-court briefs in favor
of the ADF’s position include some high-
profile supporters of gay marriage, including
Ilya Shapiro, Cato Institute legal counsel;
Eugene Volokh, University of California at Los
Angeles School of Law professor; and Dale
Carpenter , professor at the University of
Minnesota Law School.
For the state to compel a photographer to
take pictures at a same-sex wedding because
she does so at traditional weddings would be
like forcing a Democrat to write speeches for a
Republican, says a brief authored by the three
men backing the ADF’s position.
“[T]he First Amendment protects the right not
to create a message, not just the right not to
convey another’s message,” according to their
brief.
The ACLU, which filed the case on behalf of
the New Mexico lesbian couple that was
refused service, argues that the photography
shop must operate under the same anti-
discrimination laws governing all public
accommodations.
“A commercial business cannot solicit
customers from the general public to buy its
services as a photographer for hire, and then
claim that taking those photographs is a form
of its own autonomous expressive activity,”
the ACLU said in a statement.
The ACLU and major gay-rights groups are
pressing for legal sanctions against
photographers and others in the wedding
industry who refuse to participate in same-sex
ceremonies, but Mr. Carpenter says that
approach could backfire badly for supporters
of same-sex marriage.
“I would remind people in the movement that
the First Amendment has been their ally,” said
Mr. Carpenter. “We would not have the
advancement of gay rights in this country
without a libertarian-minded First
Amendment.”
It’s not hard to imagine the ACLU’s rationale
being used to compel a gay photographer to
shoot photos at, say, a wedding ceremony at
the anti-gay Westboro Baptist Church, or risk
violating federal and state laws that forbid
discrimination based on religion.
Indeed, among those filing briefs on behalf of
Elane Photography include a group of 18
wedding photographers, including some who
accept same-sex clients, according to the
ADF.
“The vast majority of same-sex couples do not
want the service providers who disagree with
participating at their celebrations, but there is
a small number of highly political activists
who will do so to make a point,” said Mr.
Carpenter . “And they will create conflicts that
do not need to exist.”
As the issue gains attention, Mr. Sears said,
he is seeing “a growing awareness that this
poses a greater threat than people thought a
few months ago.”
“To be told that I must take my talent and I
must use it to glorify that which I find wrong
or do not agree with is most troubling,” said
Mr. Sears. “That’s why I support the right of
this woman in California to tell me no. Even
for a Christmas card.”""
Washington Times.

By Muslim law (4 types or sects of Muslim) homosexuality is punishable by death, stoneing, lashing, crucification & being thrown off cliffs & buildings. Even the most moderate of the Muslims faith consider homosexuality as vile & unacceptable & condone or accept violence and or death against homosexuals.
In the British population of Muslims, %25 of all anti-homosexual crime is committed by Muslims. And %71 of this population opposes gay marriage.
With the rise of Islam in the UK & the rest of the world, we see (an inadvertent?) return to the morality of 7th century Arabia.

Ref: wikiislam

For those who do not know.. Abrahamic faiths are, Jewish, Christian & Muslim (God of Abraham)

HINDUISM: While none of the sacred texts, Vedas or Upanishads have a straightforward condemnation of vhomosexuality, as The all the Abraham faiths(Leviticus 18: 22). And Hinduism may be constructed as being more tolerant toward homosexuality. Hindus frown upon homosexuality because of the religion's emphasis on the sanctity of marriage & it's strong disapproval of premarital sex.
The laws of "MANU" in Sanskrit, the MANUSMRTI that lists religious laws has one verse, referring to homosexuality as "an unnatural act"
1993 -India high court reinstates gay marriage ban.
Section 377 of the India penal code, states that homosexual acts are punishable by life in prison.
Hindu conservatives take great offence when their gods are associated with any hint of homosexuality

Ref: Vaisnava Association also Slate.com & the two Sacred texts.. listed above & Manu laws text .. listed above

@ramblinman: Any other major religions. Like Buddhism. Maybe later or another day. 9am,Est. I need coffee & food :-)
You may want to google "The Pusher ".. & alleged serial killer in the UK. Where hundreds of bodies have been pull out if the canal, in 6 years. Statisticly too many to be uncharacteristic suicides... Also in a GAY district of nightclubs. Psychiatric community in Oxford university believe their is a gay- hater serial killer or it is anti gay attacks of " pushing" or " throwing", as I stated in my previous post, by The Muslim community. *Gangs of Muslims 'punishing' homosexuality are becoming more and more prevailant thru out the UK & the world*

@WalkSoftly: I am surprised at the lack of debate about the biggest issue with this whole thing to me..the STATE has the right to refuse service, to not issue a marriage license, but the INDIVIDUAL of that same state doesn't have the right to refuse service?.

Evidently....if that state has its own set of discrimination laws....and it feels the
individual violated them. Like Ive always said....lets someone willing to bake cakes or whatever, do what they want. Somebody will want to make the money for baking for gays or animals or Martians or whatever lol

My whole deal is that those begging for tolerance, should be willing to give it themselves.